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The Creator Economy, Portfolio Careers, And Candles, With Kudzi Chikumbu

The creator economy is rewriting the rules of modern work, blending passion with purpose in a way that reshapes how we think about careers. In this inspiring conversation, Kudzi Chikumbu—former Global Head of Creator Marketing at TikTok, fragrance entrepreneur behind Sir Candle Man, and venture advisor—opens up about his unconventional path from accounting to executive leadership, and how he’s building a multi-hyphenate career with intention. From AI’s role in creativity to the emotional dynamics of leadership, Kudzi shares what it really means to thrive in the creator economy without losing your authentic self.

Check out the full series of Career Sessions, Career Lessons podcasts here or visit pathwise.io/podcast/. A full written transcript of this episode is also available at https://pathwise.io/podcasts/kudzi-chikumbu/.

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The Creator Economy, Portfolio Careers, And Candles, With Kudzi Chikumbu

Former Global Head Of Creator Marketing At TikTok

From Accountant To Tech Executive: Kudzi Chikumbu’s Origin Story

This is Career Session, Career Lessons, brought to you by PathWise.io. If you want to take control of your career, join the PathWise community. Basic membership is free. My guest is Kudzi Chikumbu, born in Zimbabwe and raised in South Africa. Kudzi transformed from accountant to tech executive, becoming one of the longest-serving members of TikTok’s US team and acting as the former Global Head of Creator Marketing in the Los Angeles space. He has expanded his portfolio as a Venture Capital Advisor and a sought-after speaker at major business conferences. In our discussion, we’re going to be talking about Kudzi’s background, personal journey, his career to date, the creator space, the multi-hyphenate or portfolio approach to careers, and more. Let’s get going.

Kudzi, welcome. Thanks for joining me on the show.

Thank you for having me. I’m excited to be here.

Tell us a little bit about yourself. I know you were born in Zimbabwe but grew up in South Africa. How did that shape your worldview?

In the most magical way, I would say. Zimbabwe is a beautiful country. I don’t know if you’ve ever been there, but I grew up in the late ‘80s. It was post-independence. That’s when we moved to South Africa when I was about twelve. South Africa’s apartheid ended in 1994, so after that. I had this interesting experience of experiencing race relations in different ways and different countries. Also, growing up in a very community-based environment, which was the African way.

They say it takes a village. That’s how I grew up. You grow up around your cousins, aunts, and uncles in the neighborhood all the time. Those things shaped how I look at the world, through a lens of diversity and inclusion, even though I know those words are a little bit dicey to say, and community, like bringing people together. Those were my two important things.

You started as an accountant with Deloitte. How did you end up there, of all things?

Growing up as an African child, I say this and sometimes as a joke, but then I hear other African kids say this. You only have four options from your parents. Be a doctor, lawyer, accountant, or engineer. I didn’t want to be a doctor. I’m a little squeamish. I’m not good with blood and people in pain. I was good at math.

When I was studying for undergrad, I went to the University of Cape Town. You picked your major in the first year. It’s a little different from the US. My friend next to me picked Accounting, so I picked Accounting, and that led to a path of studying a lot of accounting, then becoming an accountant. I was working at Deloitte. That’s how that happened. It was more so following the path of least resistance, which is not the kind of thing people should follow.

In a lot of cases, parental pressure and the path of least resistance are pretty common reframes for people. The good news, especially now, is that careers aren’t life sentences. You can do lots of different things. You have had a bunch of change and are doing multiple things at once. We’ll get to that. You came to the US when you were working with Deloitte.

That was the first time I came. The year was 2012. They had this program where some people could go to another Deloitte office around the world. I chose San Francisco. It was amazing. It was my first time in the US. I fell in love with the West Coast, and I got to experience American work culture. People are working very hard. I’m not saying that in South Africa we don’t, but I was like, “This is intense.” It was in the middle of tax season, which you can imagine. It was intense work hours, but I love that. That’s why I moved. I was like, “There’s something about this California air that is very me.”

A lot of people say that. That’s why it’s been a popular place for people to move to for many years. You ended up going to Stanford to get an MBA. What prompted the decision to go back to grad school?

Sometimes I think life is leading me down a path, and all I have to do is pay attention, and the blessings come. It’s a very long story of why I ended up there. A story that’s not familiar to a lot of people is that some of my friends have gone to business school in South Africa. They’ve gone to Harvard Business School, so HBS, and some have gone to Stanford, the GSB, Graduate School of Business. While I was in San Francisco, I went to visit a friend who was at Stanford.

She was a friend from undergrad, and she said, “You should apply. You would get in. You’re very smart.” I never thought to apply to these schools. I loved the campus. I don’t know if you’ve been there. It’s so gorgeous. It’s a piece of heaven. I went back home after my Deloitte thing was done. I was like, “You know what? Maybe I should go to grad school,” because two things were happening. I was great at accounting, but I didn’t love it. I was an accountant by day and a YouTuber by night and on weekends. I’ve always been a creator before they even called it the creator economy. I was one of those people who made anything in a way you can make stuff.

I had all these internet friends, and I thought, “What if it works in that world?” I went to Stanford and I realized, “You can do an MBA as a way to pivot careers.” For some people, it’s elevating on the same track. For other people, they are trying to figure out what they want to do. I knew what I wanted to do, and use it as a pivot. I applied. I applied to one school, which is crazy. I didn’t know anything about anything. I didn’t know you were supposed to apply to a bunch of schools and have target schools and league schools and all the stuff. I applied and I got in. It was amazing. It truly changed the trajectory of my life.

It’s a great school and a great program. Getting in is a huge accomplishment in and of itself. Congrats on that. You use that to pivot into this creator space more full-time. What did that look like when you finished school? What were you doing with the immediate yields of getting your MBA?

I was a YouTuber before I went to school. All I wanted to do was work at YouTube. That was my goal, and I wasn’t able to do that. There’s another place that I almost worked. A guest speaker at school mentioned this cool app for creators. It’s very new and young. It’s growing fast, and a strong product market fit. That’s the app you want to join because you’ll rise with that. The app was called Musical.ly. I joined that right after grad school.

I didn’t even have headcounts. I joined as an intern, which most of my friends are like, “What? You went to this expensive school and now you’re an intern?” I love the app so much, and that app became TikTok. Musical.ly was acquired by a company called ByteDance and emerged to become TikTok. I was lucky to join a nascent company and ride that roller coaster and rise within the company.

I’m going to come back to that second. I’m curious. What were you doing on YouTube when you said you were a YouTuber?

It’s so interesting. Back in the day, with my friends, Lindy, one of my best friends. We were doing a straight-to-camera chat-type show. It was about young professionals in Africa. It was good. It had like 10,000 subs. I took it down. I don’t do this anymore, but back then, there were a lot of subs. In retrospect, it was like a low-key podcast. We would have an intro, and we would have some topics. We’d have guests and we’d interview them, and we’d wrap it up. It was what they call a video podcast now, because it was exactly the same format. We’re ahead of our time. Back then, they used to call that a vlog, like video blog, like straight to camera “travel around the world and come with me” type of blog.

Riding The Rocket Ship: Musical.ly To TikTok And Beyond

That was a thing back then. I can remember that. Not that the YouTube space was particularly my world more. It’s more what my kids were into at the time. You’d been at Deloitte, went to school, then you got to what became TikTok through the acquisitions of Musical.ly. What was that transition like in terms of culture and experience, and how did it feel for you?

It was great. I was so lucky to be there. Two things. I was a creator, and I got to work with creators. I felt like I was being myself at work, and then you’re on this rocket ship that’s growing and changing culture. When I used to work there, when I started, people would be like, “Where do you work? What is that app?” Now, I walk down the street, and people are like, “I saw this on TikTok.” I was in London. I was like, “I saw this store on TikTok.”

Career Sessions, Career Lessons | Kudzi Chikumbu | Creator Economy

Creator Economy: I was a creator working with creators. I felt like I was being myself at work, on a rocket ship that was growing and changing culture.

 

You hear this word everywhere, which is crazy to me, having been in a world of “Where is it that you work?” The changes were great. It was a master class in leadership, teamwork, and creativity. I like to say this, I went to business school, and you do a case-based style. You do a lot of case studies, but I loved all of them in person. It’s almost like I got two schools.

I went to business school as well and went through all the cases and learned a ton from them. I was in the category of people who weren’t quite sure what I wanted to do. I was coming out of the military, so it was a transition into something or a pivot, but not something that I necessarily was completely clear about when I went there. I remember sitting in school, and you probably experienced some of this as well. You’re there with the consultants and the bankers, and they seem to have seen everything and done everything. For me, a lot of it was new.

I felt that a lot. I’ve done a little bit of consulting, but not enough to feel like I’m one of the seasoned consultants, but I’ve come to learn. I look back, and they also didn’t know anything. They only knew the part of the thing that they knew because the old world was so young in business school. If I had to do it again and saw people in business school now, I’d be like, “Just soak up all the knowledge. Don’t worry about everything that’s going to happen. You have to take this moment for what it is.”

You talked about having a masterclass in leadership during your time at TikTok. What would you describe as some of your most defining moments as a leader in your time that you were there?

For the most part, we did some incredible projects that changed culture, and those are cool. We gave creators opportunities. The thing that stood out is that I came to learn I’m a good leader and a good coach. I was able to identify incredible talent who went on to rise at TikTok and beyond. Some of them were super fast promoted because they were stars. Some of them needed a little bit of coaching, and some of them needed an opportunity. To see people who started as interns and are now leading mega creator teams of other brands is cool.

You learn that at Stanford. There are two great classes that I love. One is called managing and growing enterprises. It’s fun building a business, but it’s all the conversations that need to happen to build a business. The top ones are easy ones. Why would someone follow you as a leader and coach them? That was one. I feel like a teacher kind of person, so I love that. The other one is interpersonal dynamics. It goes by touchy-feely for short. It’s like therapy for business, like how to relate to people. What do they say? What do they mean? How do you move forward from that and make things happen? That is important when you’re trying to accomplish a task. I was that leader. It was amazing to help people get large in their careers.

The Authentic Leader: Defining Your Style In A Digital Age

How do you define your authentic style, particularly in a digital age, in a sea of fakeness?

Good question. It’s all about values at Stanford. For me, it’s community, which people use as a word now. Doing it together as people. It’s very African, too. “You go far alone. You go further as a group.” That’s an African saying. That’s how I was brought up. That’s how I feel. That’s part of my style. A lot of people feel included.

I’m the person who runs the meeting or comes to the meeting, and I see someone has an idea. Maybe they feel a little bit junior, and they don’t quite know what to say. I will be like, “So and so, what do you think? I think you mentioned a good idea. Do you want to contribute?” I’m that person because I was raised like that. It’s the African way. I would say showing up as myself. I’m a Black gay man from Zimbabwe, and we moved to South Africa. I love perfumes and all of these things. I talked about that at work. I feel like being a whole person is important. I know it’s work, so you need to be professional, but you’re not a robot. You can be a real person.

Being a whole person is important. You're not a robot. Share on X

I used to do this thing called feeling words, an interpersonal dynamics. They do it at Sanford. Maybe it’s because business school students may feel like they need a little bit more soul. You would have to explain how you feel. At the beginning of the meeting, we set the temperature of the room. I used to do it when the team was much smaller, but then they got bigger, so it’s harder to do. I usually start my meetings like that. It’s like a gauge of feeling for the room. It’s like, “Maybe it’s not the week to push this person a little bit harder,” because they couldn’t do something.

It’s being able to name that. I’m that kind of leader. I’m a creator, which is another value of mine. I like creativity. I use building and creating less than creativity. I like beautiful things, like painting. I like to bring things to life. I like forward motion. I want people to move forward, like momentum. That’s my authentic leadership style. If you need forward motion, then don’t be weird.

How much do you reveal the less great side of yourself?

It’s important to be honest. Less great is an interesting phrase. One of the things I learned at business school was that as a leader, you need a full hold on the sword for your team. You take it. Your mistake is not their mistake. I’m pretty good at that. Maybe that’s not their so good side, but I’ll take it for us and make it seem like it’s not my good side.

I used to be scared when I made mistakes, to bring it up and do something. I came to learn that it holds everyone back, meaning the project doesn’t get done. There’s a learning from that mistake, which is good for everybody. It was more like a fear of failure. Now, I’m pretty open and communicative about that at work because it’s important. It’s going to be right all the time.

Stafford was great. I learned so much. Some people go to business school, and they don’t learn. What makes a terrible team member or employee is two things. One is bad judgment, and then two, being non-coachable. You need to be coachable as a person. I’m okay with making the mistake because I can be coached and I can learn.

Some people go to business school and they don't learn. Share on X

There’s a dimension of what you show up, how you show up at work, and how much you reveal your vulnerability, your flaws, and things that you maybe aren’t as good at as other people might be, and the mistakes that you make. In the creator space, there’s the influencing and all the things you put up on social media, and how much of yourself or your less great self that you put out there.

To me, it’s interesting how people make different choices about that. A lot of people hide the less great things and the not-so-great days they’re having. It’s all rainbows and unicorns. Other people are super out there, almost in a way that it becomes their persona. I was curious how people think about that, because you’ve been doing this creator stuff for long enough. I’m sure you thought about this in a deliberate way. I’m always curious how people think about where they want to fall on that continuum.

I exist online on different platforms, but it’s also me, like the values of creativity, authenticity, community, and all of the functions. All of that is the root, and the mission is to illuminate and light up people’s lives, whether I am considered a professional on LinkedIn, a podcast host, Sir Candle Man like my perfume, or the speaker on the stage. It’s all one thing. I want one person to feel pulled together and enlightened, or lit up, should I say.

With that, I understand, because I’m a marketer, that branding is important. No one is going to my LinkedIn page to hear about what I’m going through. I feel like there are guardrails and lanes in the same way you would have a brand architecture with key messaging and narratives. I know where those live in my head, and that’s how I show up. I also think you don’t need to put your full self. You should be your full self. You don’t need to show everything. That’s why we have friends in real life, I hope.

Career Sessions, Career Lessons | Kudzi Chikumbu | Creator Economy

Creator Economy: Be your full self. You don’t need to show everything; that’s what friends are for.

 

I know the young people are lonely. They should go outside to make some friends, but I’m not a firm believer. Also, the true master creator or a true content creator is building a parasocial relationship in a very specific slice of their life where they show an angle. It’s not their full life. I call those like the truly masterful ones. It’s almost like an unscripted reality show. Meaning it’s still real, but it’s just that piece. That’s okay. I don’t think people need to show everything. What do you think?

Beyond The Feed: What Working with Creators Really Taught Him

Some people go too far. There’s the trauma bragging, I’ve heard that phrase used. You’ve probably heard it as well. It gets a little cringeworthy sometimes. For some people, the traumas they have gone through are so intrinsically intertwined in their identities that they can’t be authentic without them. In those cases, it’s okay. In other cases, sometimes it feels like people take advantage of it. We all go through traumas. That’s why we have family, friends, and the people in real life. You’ve worked with a lot of creators over the years. What are some of the interesting things that you’ve learned from working with them?

I love creators. Creators are entrepreneurs. I feel like people think they’re making videos, but to be a good creator, this is what your content calendar looks like it and this is what it means you have to do, whether it’s you or a team. You are probably posting the good ones multiple times a week on a platform or multiple platforms. Let’s say, maybe three TikTok and four Instagrams. If you’re a business creator, add a LinkedIn and you’re on Threads or X, and you’re writing stuff. You probably have 10 to 15 pieces of content a week.

If it’s a video, this means you need to film it. You need to create or produce it. There’s some scripting and strategy. When someone is doing that, whether it’s your creative team, you still have to prove it, even if there’s a creative team, then you have to film it. You sit in front of the camera and you’re directing it. You are the editor at the same time because you are speaking as editing so that it works. You edit the content, put it out, and then you have to market the content. You’re a marketer as well, and you have to engage with people. You’re a community manager as well.

If you’re good, you’re probably doing press. You are a public person, you’re probably attending events, and you have to tell that story. For the good creators, it’s all about keeping a strong narrative to your work because they can’t just be random videos. It’s almost like being a chief creative officer and a CEO at the same time. That’s why I love being a creator, but also working with creators. You’re working with truly incredible minds. That’s what I love the most, the marvel at the creativity.

There’s so much out there, too. Breaking through the noise is hard. You’ve got to be good and creative. I want to come back to the point you made about you’re only seeing a narrow slice. All of us suffer to some degree with overidentifying ourselves with what we do professionally, like my job is me, or vice versa. When you lose a job or something else happens that forces you to shift gears professionally, it’s a personal blow to your identity.

Breaking through the noise is hard. You've got to be good, and you've got to be creative. Share on X

I have to believe that a lot of creators, even though it may be a narrow slice, they then become well-known public figures. It’s got to be hard for them to step out of the way that people see that narrow slice of them. I have to believe that’s challenging for a lot of the ones who are the biggest and most well-known people in the space.

It is. I’ve spoken to so many creators over the years. Sometimes, they feel trapped in that space that they’ve created, but the ones that don’t are different because they were amplifying a piece that was like truly them, versus the ones who are trapped. They created a thing that wasn’t them. The persona they created was great for the views, the virality, and the attention, but they don’t care about that thing, or like, “I’m not that person.” That’s where you get stuck. If you’re just being you, even in a little lens that you show and amplify to the world, you can get tired, but it’s not like draining.

It’s even okay to step away like, “I’ve got other things to show.” I think of Sir Candle Man. I post a video a day. I’ve done 6 or 7. People are like, “How?” I’m like, “It’s just me.” Turn the volume up a little bit, but it’s like my personality. Whereas the other versions of myself, when I used to do things like music online, and other stuff. I got tired of it so quickly and felt trapped because it wasn’t me. The key is to find a place that’s you, but it is hard when you evolve and change. Even leaving TikTok was a tough one for me. To some people, I became Kudzi from TikTok, and I love TikTok, but I’m also not just that.

Tell us a little bit about Sir Candle Man since you mentioned it a few times.

Sir Candle Man is amazing. He is me. I quote myself, and I will tell you why. He is a fragrance influencer and expert. He started by reviewing candles before the pandemic, and then it boomed in the pandemic because we were all at home, and everyone was looking to make their own so great. I learned about the craft of fragrance through the candles, and then I turned out to be a deep fragrance lover. I review the latest fragrances and candles, and talk about industry trends. I go to events. I’ve done some candle collaboration. I wrote a book, and I’ll send you one. It’s been fun.

It’s been fun to be a creator. That’s a persona, but it’s me. I get to be, as you can tell, I was an accountant. I went to Stanford. I’m basically a nerd, and I get to learn about a whole new industry. I get to learn so much, not only about formulas but about supply chains and the business of fragrance. That is exciting. I always say I’m on his journey. Whatever is open for him, I’ll go. It makes my life fun.

My sister sells flavors and fragrances. That’s what she’s done, more flavors than fragrances, but sometimes they’re a little bit intertwined. She’s done that for a long time. One of my kids has made their own candles and fragrance. They’ve been in that space.

It’s one of those senses that you don’t think about or invest in. For your sight, you have art. For your ears, you have music. Taste is food and touch, but with smell, there are so many stories you tell through your nose and senses.

Even so much of what you taste is what you’re smelling. Coming back to your time at TikTok. You’re having to balance the needs of the business versus the desires of the creators. How do you think about balancing those two things?

TikTok is a big company, but I will take a step back from TikTok. Anyone who uses a generated content platform needs to have great content so that people keep watching, so that you’re able to monetize the platform, whether that’s obligatory or in other ways. There are different ways people make money. The content is almost like currency, and the content comes from two places. It comes from people, so creators, or it comes from publishers like companies. You need to make sure that those people feel loved.

It’s about building products that are user-centric for the viewer but also user-centric for the creator, and that is balancing the business scene. If they’re able to stay on the platform and create, you’re good. It’s when you start doing things up that they don’t need that it doesn’t work. TikTok is great for creators. There are so many ways you can be creative out there. It’s almost like a playground of creativity.

Where do you think the space is going over the next five years?

There’s so much happening. All the AI creators are cool, and I don’t mean just putting problems into LLM models, but through AI animation and stories. I’ve seen cool. I know it scares a lot of people, understandably, but it’s given people creative superpowers that they could have maybe not made the thing. I think that’s very cool. At the same time, people are also going to want even more human connection. They’ll have the power of social relationships with their age and whatnot.

They’ll still love true talents like everyday people creators. You’re going to have this like AI stars and even bigger human stars because I don’t think they can do that without human connection, and then everyday people. TikTok was great at giving everyday people the opportunity to create. With AI, it’s going to be even more.

One of my brother’s focus areas is writing country songs. He has this persona that’s been AI-generated. The music is all sung in an AI-generated way. I’m curious where this goes. He’s put a fair amount of thought into the songs and has them up on the major music platforms. It will be interesting to see how that space evolves because so much of the music industry now is in live performances. It used to be you did the live performances to sell your albums, and now you create the music, so you have something to go out on tour with. It’s completely changed, and AI works against that because you can’t take an AI-generated singer out on tour.

There’s a lot of AI-generated music. I have some friends in the space. It’s very cool. The key thing there is the ethical sourcing of the platform. The same with the AI.

The Multi-Hyphenate Career: Why Portfolio Work Is The Future

Let’s switch gears and talk a little bit about portfolio career, or as you call it, the multi-hyphenate career. What makes you a believer in this as the right model?

People keep asking me, “How were you the Kudzi at TikTok, a speaker, Sir Candle Man, and whatnot?” I was like, “I don’t think of them separately. I am one person with one mission.” A lot of people think, “How do they do that for themselves?” I was like, “Nowadays, particularly young professionals, they’re going to need to.” With AI threatening to take your job, you need to be a master prompter, but you probably are going to have not just a side hustle but a truly other source of income.

The paths to careers are shifting, with AI taking away those entry-level jobs. Everyone wants to be an influencer, according to the data and research. The best way to do it is to build a career that’s as interesting as you are. It’s so much like a flywheel career. The reason Sir Candle Man works with TikTok is that I was a creator, and being a creator makes me better at my job at TikTok, which makes me a better speaker. It’s all one thing. The show is not just one thing, but it’s all connected. That’s where it came from. The future of work has to be a portfolio of things that are strategically put together in one narrative.

It’s becoming more and more common that portfolio careers, the gig economy, and all of these platforms exist to help you find talent. You have the reality of “How am I going to get health insurance, in the US at least?” It does seem like it’s becoming more common. It had me wondering, does this mean that traditional corporate jobs are on the decline? Are they still going to be right for people? Are they anachronisms? I’m curious to get your views on that.

We’re still going to have companies that need people to work. I will say this. For me, two things had happened. I’m so grateful to Deloitte in those early days because they taught me incredible professional skills, like communication, attention to detail, business thinking, and business writing, all the things. Sometimes, I see people write an email and I’m like, “Who taught you how to write a business email? This is terrible.”

Back then, you would have email training. You would have how to format a document, like a spreadsheet training, which people now throw into some model. It teaches you fundamentals and foundational skills that take you throughout your career, like how to communicate. It’s important. People still need those, especially the young people. I don’t think you can learn from that LLM models and ChatGPT, or call it whatever you want. You need to wrestle with that sentence and be able to do that. That’s what’s important.

I left TikTok because I was like, “I want to go back into the mix.” I realized I worked for myself, which is beautiful, but I enjoy working with people. My teamwork and strategy, and Gen Z will kill me. Even going to the office and having conversations because the work happens not just with the work, but around the work as well. You’ll also get to be a community and a network that takes you not only for this job, which is good, but also for the future.

Those jobs are still very important, particularly when you’re younger. People can get them. Also, I’m very lucky that I can be in a transition state for a while, but even the benefits. I know people don’t like to talk about it. Healthcare and all that stuff are important. I would still believe in all the perks, too. I would encourage people to figure out a situation where they can do a corporate job that gives them flexibility or time to do other stuff, too.

It’s relevant for me. I’ve left the fairly intensive corporate job and have to decide. Do I want to go back into another corporate job? Do I want to do something fractional, so I’ve got time to do other things, and I’ll say the other parts of my time? Do I want to go completely portfolio and see how that plays out? More people will be considering those kinds of options as they go through some career transition or another.

Fractional is hot now. That’s what the people are doing.

In the post Kudzi from TikTok era, what’s the full breadth of your portfolio look like now?

We have a few things. We have Sir Candle Man. That’s content creation. I’m working on a fragrance business, which takes a long time to create the juice. That’s Sir Candle Man, but also a consumer product. I’m an advisor for some tech social media companies and also mini brands. I like to keep my mind going and stay up to date with stuff. That’s a great way of learning new technology. I’m a speaker. I speak on topics around career, creators, and AI creators, then a podcast, which I worked to bring the thread together to show what I’m doing, and also help other people. It’s called Not Just One Thing, which is this idea of being a portfolio company. That’s my portfolio.

Also, being a better friend. I was in this amazing friendship for a long time. I was one of the people that I was always working and traveling. I don’t think I nurtured my relationships as much as I should have or as much as I think I did. My friends are great. They love each other. I love them, but I was like, “Life has lived in the details.” You’ve got to spend time with people, and you have to be intentional about making it happen all the time.

As they say, “Nobody is going to remember you for exactly what you did at work unless you are one of the career titans of business.” For most of us, the vast majority is it’s not going to be that monumental in the scheme of things. You’ve got to go through life with people around you. What practices help you stay in touch with your true self, other than connecting with friends, as you mentioned?

I was raised Catholic. I don’t practice it anymore, but I’m big in prayer. I pray every day. I’m a journaler. I do a gratitude journal. I like to walk outside. It’s important to be outside. I keep in touch with my friends. I’m not a big hiker, but I’m an outdoor person, where I meditate and journal to regulate my nervous system. What do you do? I need some new stuff.

I run. I hike. My things generally involve some form of exercise. I do a lot of writing. I don’t journal in the way that you’re describing. I’ve maybe should try it, but it always felt like it would be a burden to me. Maybe I need to give it a try and see, but I do write episodically sometimes for hours and sometimes for minutes. I would say things like being outside, communing with nature. I did a week of hiking. I’m running a lot because I’m training for a race. Those are the things that help me, apart from spending time with family and keeping connected to the people that are in my life.

What do you write?

I write a lot about leadership, management, and careers. It’s all non-fiction. I don’t think I’ve got enough of a command of the English language to write a fiction book. When I read good fiction, it is very clear to me that it is well beyond anything that I would ever be close to being able to do, so I stick more to non-fiction.

That is so true. I was reading a book. I read a lot of books, but I wish I knew how to put sentences together like that. It’s truly a gift when it’s so well written. It’s insane. My brain doesn’t work like that.

Do you ever deal with impostor syndrome?

Yes, but I’m pretty quick to stop. I say, “That’s not real.” Do you know why? I’ve been in spaces in different places in senior rooms. I’m like, “These are just people.” Some of them are wrong, they don’t know what they’re talking about, or they know but they don’t know everything. You can’t be an impostor. You can just be a student. If you’re smart with asking questions, you can get there pretty quickly in general. I’m not talking about trying to be a rocket scientist or something. I’m talking about marketing. They don’t know that one tool or that one metric. Ask the question, “Can you tell me more about that?” It’s a waste of time if you hold yourself back.

You’re going to have days that will feel crappy to be blunt. On those days when you need some way of picking yourself up, some people will depend on their friends. Some people will go do something completely out of control. Some people talk themselves back off the edge of the cliff. That’s learning how to get the self-talk back to the point where it’s helping to pull you back from whatever is making you feel crummy at that particular point in time, afraid, a failure, or whatever. Developing that ability is a pretty important thing, but to some degree, everybody has to face some degree of impostor syndrome because nobody is perfect at everything.

Exactly. You’ve got to live life. You’ve got to give it a shot. This is the one thing. If you spend your life so worried about not being good enough, you’re going to miss the whole thing.

Evolving Success: From Hustle To Holistic Fulfillment

Has your definition of success changed over the years?

Yes. Growing up, I was like, “If you work harder and make more money, everything will be fine.” I worked hard and made a lot of money, but I was sick. That doesn’t work. It must be balanced, and you must like your life or the day. I always ask myself, “Am I excited to do this? Do I want to do this? Am I excited about this day?” If the answer is yes, that’s success to me. It’s much more about the balance to be all than the accomplishments of money.

I’ve gotten great accomplishments and great awards, and they always feel great, then that always ends. I learn this important lesson with Musical.ly and TikTok. When I started Musical.ly, it was on the rise, then it plateaued, and all the friends you make in the industry are like, “Go away. The phone is not as buzzy, and the inbox is a little bit dry.” It started up again. The same people come back, and then TikTok became number one in the world.

I leave TikTok, and some of them don’t care anymore. Luckily, I had learned it the first time. This is even amazing when you do this stuff, but you need real relationships with real people and build a life that you love. One must be great and like, “Yes, do it well,” but it’s not who you are. I’m lucky I learned that when I was younger. They think you can easily become a person of the place versus a real person.

What’s your view on how inclusivity is working in the tech and creator spaces now?

I grew up in Zimbabwe, and I went to this nice private school, which had very few Black kids. They have a lot of White kids and other people of color. I always see in the lens a little full spectrum in terms of color. South Africa is a very diverse place. They call it the rainbow nation for a reason. Diversity and inclusion representation have always been how I see the world.

When I’m in spaces where it is not, it’s a little bit jarring. My instinct is to try to get to my homeostasis, which is diverse and inclusive. It’s less like, “Let’s build a program.” I’m more like, “Let’s make the world look like the world.” In the world now, even when I think about places that I want to work, people whom I want to work with or work for, I go and I look at their company. I look at the About Us team page, and if I don’t see the representation, I know it’s not for me. What I’m not trying to do is fight for my identity in the workplace.

In technology, it depends on the company. TikTok is pretty cool because it’s super diverse, and there are some other companies where it’s not. All the studies have shown and pulled out the studies for years that have seen better returns or better results. People know the information. I think they just have to choose to use it. If they don’t want to use that information, you just have to address that it’s such an issue for you.

What are some of the things that you do to advocate for change where you find yourself in the position to do that?

The best way is your time and your money. If you’re hiring people, hire diverse people. I’m going to make sure my team looks like that. My advocacy is in my actions. I don’t want to be fighting people and writing memos about how we need to change. I feel like some of those things are how they are. I would probably hire a team. If we’re finding vendors, I’ll find one that is diverse. That’s where the money is at. Money and people. I mentor a lot, whether that’s at TikTok or outside, and then I connect them with people I know. That’s a form of action in order to help them. I’m more action-focused than just talking about it.

You can make yourself crazy talking about it. When you’re in the wrong room or with the wrong people, you’re only going to be able to move the needle so much. At the same time, if you take your small actions and other people are taking their small actions, those actions start to add up to something real and big.

I feel action over words.

Who are some voices that you think we should be paying more attention to now?

All I do is listen to all the AI leaders, but I don’t know if we need to be paying more attention to them. I do think it’s important for people, whether that’s them or Satya or whoever. You need to know how the world is changing all the time, and this is truly the advent of a new world. I love that. Anything that teaches me about the future of the world, the way we’re going. That work is important, but I still have some people and friends who are like, “I’ll put my head in the sand and go, “Great. It all stays the same.” I’m like, “That’s not a strategy.” What about you? Who are you listening to? Who should I listen to?

I run a lot, as I mentioned. When I go out running, I listen to music. I do a podcast, yet I don’t listen to a ton of other podcasts. I tend to listen to music and decompress, but I do a fair amount of reading. I read a pretty broad array of nonfiction. I’m trying to understand the world more deeply, whether that’s from a science perspective, a technology perspective, an economic perspective, or a geopolitical perspective.

You only get so much time on the planet. You can’t understand everything, but my interest, I would say, gets broader in some ways the older I get, because you start realizing you’ve got limited time and you want to soak up as much as you can. I tend to go less deep on things than I used to, because I don’t necessarily feel the same pull of going down the rabbit hole. When I was younger, I would definitely get on the rabbit hole.

Do you read-read meaning like a book or audio, or summaries?

I read almost always the books. I’ll read paper books and on a Kindle reader. Typically, it’s a mix. Sometimes, I’ll get electronic copies of books from people to read. Sometimes from my parents or somebody else in my life will hand me some books to read, physical books. When I’m traveling, I don’t like to carry the weight.

That’s always the problem, but the youth don’t read. They throw it into ChatGPT and ask for a summary. I’m like, “You need to know how to read.”

It’s a fair point. If you can get something summarized for yourself. In a lot of instances, that may be enough, but on the flip side, there are times, going back to what we were talking about, writing. The nuance, the color, and the detail, you can’t summarize that. If you want to soak up the full richness of somebody’s piece of work, you’ve got to read it or listen to it or whatever. You can’t just say, “Give me the ten bullet points.”

I’m the same with music from an artist. If they have an album of my liking, I will listen top down and my sister, which younger than me. She likes to jump around. I’m like, “What are you saying?” It was a body of work. It was made to be consumed in this way. The time is different.

Beyond Work: Redefining Success And Leaving A Legacy

You talked a little bit about what’s next for you. How are you more broadly thinking about your next chapter?

I’ve been so lucky that I’ve had time to reflect and to come back to the same value. It’s almost like the Wizard of Oz. Creativity. I still love creators. Giving people opportunities and communities is important, and technology. I will probably continue in that realm and world from a full-time job perspective or whatever endeavors I choose to do.

I do want a more balanced approach to my life. I still do good work, but I’m going to live my life, have a family, and do all that. That’s important to me. I need a new relationship with work because I’m a little bit of a workaholic, but it’s been good. Even at this time, I set a day and I’m done at 5:00. I’m still on my laptop, still typing, and having a meeting, but I try to shut it down because the old me never shut it down.

I agree. I’m trying to do a little bit of the same. When all is said and done, what kind of legacy do you want to leave?

My favorite quote of all time is Marianne Williamson’s quote, which is, “As you let your own light shine, you unconsciously get people the permission to do the same.” Going back to that mission of lighting up people’s lives, Sir Candle Man does candles, and Kudzi the motivator does with careers, mentors, and people, and my podcast. It’s all the same thing. I want anyone who has touched anything or seen anything I’ve done to feel a little bit of light and illumination. I was a good person for me. That was good. That’s good enough.

Career Sessions, Career Lessons | Kudzi Chikumbu | Creator Economy

Creator Economy: I want anyone who’s touched anything or seen anything on the podcast. I’m down to feel a little bit of light and illumination. That’s good enough.

 

That’s a great quote. Thanks for doing this.

Thank you so much. This was so fun. Thank you. I appreciate it.

I appreciate it, too.

I want to thank Kudzi for joining me to discuss his personal and career journey, the creator space, portfolio careers, and a little bit about social impact and inclusion, too, and the legacy that he wants to leave behind. It’s an interesting conversation. As a reminder, it was brought to you by PathWise.io. If you’re ready to take control of your career, you can join the PathWise community. Basic membership is free. You can also sign up on the website for the PathWise newsletter. Follow us on LinkedIn, Facebook, YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok. Thanks. Have a great day.

 

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About Kudzi Chikumbu

Career Sessions, Career Lessons | Kudzi Chikumbu | Creator EconomyHaving built his own multi-hyphenate career spanning continents and industries, Kudzi Chikumbu embodies the portfolio approach he champions. Born in Zimbabwe and raised in South Africa, he transformed from accountant to tech executive, becoming one of the longest-serving members of TikTok’s U.S. team and former Global Head of Creator Marketing.

Currently Los Angeles-based, Kudzi has expanded his portfolio as a venture capital advisor and sought-after speaker at major business conferences, including Zillow Unlock and INBOUND. He is also the much-beloved creator of “Sir Candle Man,” a respected voice in the luxury fragrance world featured in The Hollywood Reporter, House Beautiful and Good Morning America. His journey proves that your career doesn’t have to be linear. It just has to be yours.

 

 

 

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